Matt Damon serves as Chief Content Officer and pitches in, between starring in films likeOppenheimer.
Man, you got old.
MATT DAMON:I did, man.
Ben Affleck and Matt Damon at the ‘Air' world premiere at SXSW 2023Getty Images
Well, were shooting a movie, and Im starring in it with Ben.
Thats why hes got the beard, too.
DEADLINE:Thats quite a growth Ben.
‘Small Things Like These’Enda Bowe
So were finally getting a movie about those brothers on the cough drop box?
AFFLECK:Damn, you busted us.
Its actually a movie calledRIP, about undercover cops.
So for me and Matt, this is our undercover look.
Now you haveSmall Things Like These, which couldnt be more different.
DAMON:Thats not too far off.
And particularly what Cillian was doing.
He said he had this little movie based on a Claire Keegan novella and a script by Enda Walsh.
It sounded exactly like what we were looking for, and Alan Moloney was already attached to produce it.
We had just done the U2 documentaryKiss the Futuretogether.
It was an incredibly frictionless process.
We explained the whole system to them.
But to tell you the truth, it was very little.
Those guys knew exactly the movie they wanted to make.
They came back with this beautiful movie and we watched a number of cuts and gave feedback.
But were not a prescriptive studio.
In this case, that team was just phenomenal and it was proof of concept for us.
Weve been doing this a long time, both of us, and we felt that this would work.
It was definitely gratifying to see it work this well the first time out.
DEADLINE:Ben, explain why this fit the Artists Equity model and how it worked favorably for Cillian?
They would have a sense of authorship and the voice we wanted them to have.
When you have that, our belief is youre going to get the best possible results creatively.
Youll have people that, from both a commercial and creative standpoint, care about what an audience experiences.
From a promotional standpoint, they want to get behind the movie, they want to talk about it.
Thats a really big deal, a credit to Cillians commitment to it.
DEADLINE:How does Cillian Murphy and others benefit?
Are they shareholders as opposed to the traditional practice of selling the script to a financier?
They help manage the risk downward and they reap the rewards of that.
Thats something thats like common sense.
And that has become this enshrined ritual in Hollywood.
They are investors and we wanted to treat them that way.
DEADLINE:When you do a bigger movie likeRIPorThe Accountant 2, is it the same formula?
Inevitable, and then theres going to be a ton of money.
And stories about, can you believe how much money they paid so and so?
There is every possibility you will have to pay out big winnings.
Being flexible is part of the DNA of what were trying to do.
So we work to fashion the same philosophical deal in different ways each time.
That has required some innovating and reexamining of traditional models.
Its no secret theres a retraction in spending.
I suspect this year it will be 20%-25% overall, relative to pre-strike spending.
Youve got this retrenchment, and this desire to spend less.
Weve tried to find solutions to pay, for there to be meaningful performance incentives.
To answer your question, we broadly apply the principles of the same model.
We apply the same principles.
The ways in which theyre executed vary, but thats something we learned from Hollywood.
AFFLECK:Matt said it really so well, its really about the best notes or contributions.
Not prescriptive notes, but genuine reactions.
I didnt understand this or this didnt seem very funny to me, or I wasnt moved by this.
And thats the sort of worst case.
I dont think this is working.
And so we tend to try restrict ourselves to, well, what if he were angrier here?
Might that help us understand something?
What it teaches you is in part how to respond to a filmmaker while a film is in process.
Often, its hard.
We learned as much by negative example as positive.
That part of the process is probably more meaningful than the production phase.
What we want to be is supportive, additive.
Were not going to dictate.
We say, youre a grownup.
We agree on that.
You stay within those lines.
Youre going to make the movie you want to make.
DEADLINE:You both started out withGood Will Hunting.
That put you on the map, and soon you were first-dollar-gross movie stars.
Talk about how compensation evolved that led the two of you to feel this way is best.
AFFLECK:The way you describe gross is fair.
Weve all heard anecdotes of the studio that lost money while the stars made $90 million.
Thats not fair in anybodys mind, or its certainly not in mine.
But the correction to that was to define profits differently.
There are plenty of those stories too.
So weve tried to distill and make more clear how people are compensated.
Its sort of a cash grab in the moment.
Were all subject to this sort of insecurity in this business.
Whether were actors or directors or writers, the phone could stop ringing for us.
This is the time to take the money.
But what that does is puts people at cross purposes.
The people invested in the movie are not aligned exactly with the people who are doing it.
I dont know when this might go away.
Naturally, people seek to do whats in their best interest.
And so thats part of what you have to account for.
Look, Ive been in movies likeGigli, thats a famous example.
I got a big cash payday for that.
Well, it doesnt feel right in retrospect because they lost money.
Nonetheless, that doesnt sit right with me.
The answer is, fairness.
But we also dont want to be taken advantage of for that.
Its a beautiful, wonderful, fortunate way to make a living.
They often see the same thing, reapplied multiple times.
You cant just rely on whats worked before.
So there is some nature of risk and we seek to balance those two extremes.
We dont want to do something thats unfair for one party or the other.
There are no overages, ever.
And so then we then take on that responsibility and we ask that the filmmakers share that with us.
Thats what were trying to emulate.
You with theBourne Identityfranchise and many others, Ben starring but also writing and directing films likeThe TownandArgo.
Why was it important for you to reconnect in such a disruptive long-term way like Artists Equity?
DAMON:We had this experience onThe Last Duel.
I was watching it with my youngest daughter and she turned and looked at me.
She said, Dad, why are you crying?
That was the impetus behind putting this company together.
I was like, what are we doing, man?
Both of us, this is what we love to do more than anything.
How much life do we have left and what are we going to do with it?
Its like when people say George Clooney or Oprah Winfrey should run for president.
That is the most demanding job, and they have jobs.
Arent there moments when you pine for a simpler life of learning your lines on a movie set?
AFFLECK:Well, its definitely true.
They said look, we just want you to know this is going to be a lot of work.
I really underestimated that.
Theres a greater responsibility and theres definitely more headaches.
But Im kind of glad I didnt know.
DEADLINE:How about you, Matt?
Bens our CEO, and then its my wife.
Nobody spends more time at this than my wife.
But Bens there day to day behind the big desk with the suit on.
AFFLECK:Im exclusive to this company so I can only work for Artists Equity.
That opportunity is great for you, Matt, but also great for the company.
I cant tell you how meaningful that is.Small Thingsis a great example, with Matts relationship with Cillian.
Telling me, this guys an incredible actor.
We should be doing this movie.
Because particularly in cases like this, were asking people to do things that havent been done.
DAMON:But its also just our relationships in general, right?
Weve been on the other side of the camera our whole lives, and suddenly have this little studio.
Lucy reads it and tells me you got to read this one.
So I read it and Casey and I start talking about it.
Well, who would be the best person to direct this?
Hey, what about Doug Liman?
I think its really good.
Casey wrote it and we want to do it with you.
And the next day Dougs calling back going, yeah, I want to do it.
Things came together just as quickly withSmall Things Like These.
There doesnt have to be that normal lag that takes place in the movie business.
He did a spectacular job withUnstoppable, which premiered at Toronto and comes out early next year.
Listen, theres good days and hard days.
I dont care who you are.
OnThe Last Duel, we agreed we ought to do more stuff together.
Life is just a lot more fun and rewarding when were spending time together, and working together.
And that was as much a guiding principle of this, going forward.
What do we want?
It was incredibly rewarding to see Billy get his standing ovation at Toronto.
You see the Rotten Tomatoes forSmall Thingsand the reviews are so rapturous.
It is more rewarding than any of the personal kind of gratification from my own career, honestly.
I love this company and what were doing.
An advertising agency, working with major brands.
An unscripted division, were going to deliver four movies this year and six next year.
I love every bit of it.
Did you know we have Eric Roth running a feature writers room?
DEADLINE:The Eric Roth, the Oscar winner forForrest Gumpwho scriptedHereand worked with Matt onThe Good Shepherd?
We have these salons where directors, filmmakers, actors come in and talk and then the writers work.
It was taken as an idea fromMank.
So its a little different.
DAMON:We dont have the actors under contract and were not going to.
Its compensation thats driven based on how successful the movie is.
And also you get your pretty good weekly rates.
But what we found is that in so many cases, the writers didnt come in obsessed with money.
Then theres a lot of thrill in being able to actually see that come to life.
Its thrilling and yeah, part of my job then is the headaches around that.
I want this to be a sort of soup-to-nuts entity that could do anything up to essentially distribution.
Theyve got these pipes, theyve built this elaborate, sophisticated distribution internet.
So far, Im really proud of everything weve done.Small Things, Air, Accountant 2, The Instigators.
Unstoppable, which Jennifer Lopez is terrific in.
Working with our old friend Joe Carnahan onRIPfor Netflix.
I dont think its an accident.
Were not getting lucky.
DAMON:It all starts with quality, right?
Quality films, we make good movies, all of our problems are solved.
Ben turned to me about three weeks in.
He is directing the picture and he goes, I havent heard the word no yet.
Im on my third movie for Artists Equity and its a different feeling on set.
We went over budget in one category onAir, which was food trucks.
We had five food trucks a day sitting out in the base camp parking lot.
Gus commits, making the movie happen.
Then, he said, you invited him to audition to play that third guy in the car.
My question: Were you just f*cking with him?
DAMON:That is a bold-face lie.
Everything about that story is untrue…
AFFLECK:Really?
I dont know where to start.
First of all, we wrote the part for Casey.
He knew it the whole time.
There was no audition.
I dont know why he says what he says sometimes.
I think hes just an inveterate prankster.
